Gold and More-1

357 thoughts on “Gold and More-1

  1. I think you have to be “brave” to change. First you have to admit your wrong – and sometimes that is not easy. Really when you think about it – you have nothing to lose…..Only the time invested in a well thought out solve. I changed something in my solve…………

    So I am going to tell you – I have added Chief Joseph to my solve. There are a number of reasons………..

    In taking a close look at his farewell speech ( I have always loved his farewell speech ) I found many things.

    CES recorded that speech and there is controversy about how he took poetic liberties with it. Did he get it 85 % right? But that aside…here is what I found….

    The last words of it are – “I shall fight no more forever”. That is also the final word of a chapter in the book..

    In the surrender poem he says “hear me”. He also says “tell him I am tired.

    “No fire” is important……..

    Ces in 1877, add the word “wet” to a certain version.

    Ces wrote “Poet in the Desert”

    This entire speech was about ” a cry for peace”.

    Chief Joseph rode a black horse.

    Ces is – Charles Erskine Scott WOOD.

    CES was a wild character and so fun to study……I love the photos of his house.

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    • inthechaseto- thanks for posting that article. very well written. I like what Linda said…”who in the hell does he think he is?” Heh Heh Heh….my sentiments exactly.

      as you and Deb have probably seen, capital e twinkle has been asking about me on Dal’s blog. I tried to post this….”Hello e twinkle, Hunch here…piss off”

      of course that bit of news never went to press.
      Heh Heh HEH.

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  2. Bob –

    You said this –

    …. the teachers with ropes drawing contains a hidden capital letter F.

    I don’t see it – where is it?

    I will give you a hint as to who is sitting in the car – what would happen if that car rolled………

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        • This girl is wound up!!!! Ha ha, BOOM! It’s a WyLL thing… Don’t mind me, this week is so bo-day-ciouS with Vet day and Friday the 13th. Someone won’t feel lucky. Love the bow on the girl by the way…

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    • into- and you can find the other capital F in the drawing of young FF milking Bessie. its under the cows tail tied to the stool leg.
      to me, what they mean (the two capital F’s) is the blaze in TTOTC. so we found the blaze and if you look quickly down in the drawings you see feet. many of them. now apply this to the draper display of McCracken. you see the feet of two men at a dig site and the chest is right there. Geydelkon has the photo on his website titletothegold.

      on dals blog a long time ago there was much discussion about the blaze being an FF carved in an aspen tree.

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  3. Jack:
    Yes Bob, you are correct, but those old masons had specialized knowledge. They were called “free” because they were free to travel from place to place in medieval society unlike others who could only travel with permission from their feudal lord. Their freedom came from the fact that they possessed knowledge that others didn’t. They knew how to build things. So they were determined to keep that knowledge secret and communicate with each other using coded messages, symbolism, metaphor, allegory, etc. It is that legacy of secret communication that modern Masons preserve and use.

    Fenn has said he was not a mason , but replied but thank you to the question. he still could use this to communicate- also, wyoming was covered up with fraternal organizations – I have found Venus if that matters to anyone try George Ghikas in Sheridan Wyoming- his wife Venus and Ms. Mary Kooi Brown were members of Naomi chapter of the order of the Eastern Star

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    • Crow –

      Do you have a link to FF saying that – and if so, could you please post it here……..was it in an e-mail to someone?

      I don’t think it matters one way or the other – if FF is a mason or not…… the point is – it is a way of telling if you are right….as when you get to the end they are in order. A very particular order……….. 🙂 So, knowing IF anyone was a mason or not could become a giant hint for you. There are lists of famous people who were Masons – Clark Gable etc……

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    • jack- and im guessing secret building skills were used for fortresses to defend against enemies. to keep the king and his court safe from attack. so it makes sense you wouldnt want your mason to go off and build a fortress for your enemies that was as strong or stronger than your own.

      i dont think any body ever asked Clark Gable “the mason” to build a fort.

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    • Crow –

      It sounds like the basis of a very good solve to me …………..

      If you can find where the poem fits along the way – good……….

      I think FF did this in an elegant way and it will all make sense in the end…….. every single piece of it.

      I also think where to start is RIGHT in the poem and right in your face. I also think the valley that you follow along the path is written in the poem in plain sight – no codes and no anagrams………………. pretty amazing.

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  4. into:
    Crow –

    I see what you are pointing at and really like the Mark Twain connection and know many people have gone in that direction – it may be correct.

    When many people go in one direction – I tend to go in another…………

    I only used him some because he traveled the oregon trail as well as did edison

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      • Crowdog –

        Right on………… ,many things here have been tied to Forrest Gump – I just haven’t been able to do that – might take another look.

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        • how bout hobo springs by saratoga and not far form there is treasure island and the miracle mile and the treasure of the sierra madre i went to 1413 main street in Torrington which ties to Connecticut Yankee draft he owns by Mark Twain which could be heavy loads and high waters and schooners instead of the constega wagons were used i even found elfin motors LOL you can find rainbow falls just east of there on google earth if you click on the pictures

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          • those schooners were ferry’d and even floated across the rivers creeks and streams on the way west at parting of the ways we find two wise owls from same frat at Washington and Jefferson university

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          • we go to washington and jefferson and find the immortal six and we find the wyoming valley in pennsylvania which possibly might of been some of the first blood of the revolutionary war around Mary Washington University at Fredericksburg not to mention she was curious georges mother

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          • Crow –

            I see what you are pointing at and really like the Mark Twain connection and know many people have gone in that direction – it may be correct.

            When many people go in one direction – I tend to go in another………… 🙂

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  5. Well Ok Newbies –

    Trust me this was a lot of hard work and you are getting it free here – this was a combined work of many ……

    Since the cat was just let out of the bag, in easy fashion, I don’t see why you shouldn’t have the info too…………. here it is

    s28.postimg.org/f6ftiv7y5/compilation_ttotc_and_rockwell_pic.jpg

    Norman Rockwell is a very interesting study ….. he had many fires and still pursued his work………

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      • You bet Gey –

        You remember those good ole days – when we were all working hard on this one………..

        So is there one more than the five listed….?

        I saw one in the scrapbooks…….re diving – so do we have to lay down to see the end?

        PS I did that – it didn’t work……. 🙂

        Anyone see any Rockwells in the scrapbooks?

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      • JacK –

        Oh my gosh – it is so good to see you still posting here – You were indeed the very first person to discover this very important clue……………

        I thank you Jack so much even today. I was applauding you way back then – over 2 years ago.

        If you take everything we found on this blog and put it together – there is your solve.

        It’s all in knowing “how” to do that.

        A resounding applause for you Jack and a standing Ovation !!!

        How the heck are you?

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        • Hey Into- Thanks! Someone mentioned the Rockwell connection on chasechat so I thought I would see if I could find the thread here in the archives. Back then, Mike’s was the best place for new ideas that could move one forward in solving this thing.

          Revisiting Rockwell makes me think it is definitely a hint to something that helps solve the clues in the poem. The first Rockwell is obvious – it is almost totally copied. As you progress the Rockwell copied images are more disguised. The cow milking is reversed, the boys running are put into a different context. Ruby Bridges is lifted from the Rockwell where she is the central image and placed in a group of kids. It is like he is challenging us to find the Rockwells as we progress through the book.

          Chris Yates seems to think he found something significant in the catalog numbers of the Rocwell paintings. That is possible. The Rockwell connection must be meaningful somehow. Here is my theory posted at chasechat:

          Norman Rockwell was a prominent Freemason, as were Lewis and Clark, Kit Carson, George Washington, and Benjamin Franklin (“Three people can keep a secret if two of them are dead”). According to some accounts, Dr. Pepper himself was a freemaon. It’s not a coincidence that Philadelphia was the city that he covered with his thumb. Freemasonry is based on secrecy and hiding messages in plain sight. Also associated with treasure legends.
          Do you see the similarity of theme and message here?:

          Forrest Fenn, The Thrill of the Chase, My War for Me chapter: “When the realization hit me, at last I knew. If I cannot enrich those with whom I interact each day and cause them to be better for my having passed their view, then I have wasted my turn. That I succeed in this endeavor is not as important as it is for me to make a solid try. For if the try is sincere I have succeeded in whatever failure resulted…. So now, at last, at least I know. And if no one should ever think of me when I passed this vale, it will be of no consequence, for I have finally found my way and am at peace with all of it.”

          Albert Pike, who published a book called Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry in 1871: “What we have done for ourselves alone dies with us; what we have done for others and the world remains and is immortal.”

          The Lost Symbol by Dan Brown (home of Brown?) : “Masonic ritual was designed to awaken the slumbering man inside, lifting him from his dark coffin of ignorance, raising him to the light, giving him eyes to see. Only through the death experience could man fully understand his life experience. Only through the realization that his days on earth were finite could he grasp the importance of living those days with honor, integrity, and service to his fellow man.”

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          • To follow up on the previous post: Whenever Freemasonry is mentioned, people start debating whether or not Forrest is a Freemason himself. Fenn may or may not be a Freemason. I don’t think it matters. He created the Chase and needed a way to present the clues and hide his secret information in his poem. Much of the stuff about Freemasonry found in popular culture may or may not be true, but it is intriguing and cool how they hide information in plain sight through symbols, numbers, and metaphor. There is a ready made “system” of hiding messages and clues available to him, whether or not he belongs to the Masons. Dan Brown, a non-Mason, uses it in his novels. The writers of National Treasure used it. Fenn is probably a fan of Dan Brown. He may have access to him through Doug Preston (pure speculation, but possible). The Lost Symbol was published one year prior to TTOTC. Certainly, Fenn’s realization about the meaning of his life closely coincides with the Freemason ideal of how one should live, whether he actually is a Freemason or not.
            He says there are hints in the book that will help you interpret the clues in the poem. I spent a lot of time a few years ago trying to find what the hint was about Rockwell. To use 5 of his images in the book must be meaningful somehow. Especially since the girl holding the rope was lifted from the Rockwell painting and stuck in the drawing in the middle of the non-Rockwell kids (she, or rather a Rockwell hint, is hidden in there for you to find). I don’t think the hint is rocks or wells, I think it NR’s well known Freemason connection as well as the others I mentioned in the previous post.

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        • standing with you Into, yes good to see Jack again. of all the famous freemasons does anybody here really believe that any of these guys could build anything out of stone? thats what a mason was, long ago. wasnt a mason a guy who could shape and stack rocks into a structure? that was a skill before the mass manufacture of bricks. and especially stone arches which were extremely difficult. the pyramids of egypt are a monumental tribute to masonry. masons of old were held in high regard, their talents sought after. so these modern “masons” are simply attaching themselves to an ancient hierarchy of society that truly, no longer exists because of modern building techniques and machines.
          but, as FF says….it doesnt matter what you are only what you can make others believe.
          forget about masons and Rockwell, the teachers with ropes drawing contains a hidden capital letter F.

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          • Yes Bob, you are correct, but those old masons had specialized knowledge. They were called “free” because they were free to travel from place to place in medieval society unlike others who could only travel with permission from their feudal lord. Their freedom came from the fact that they possessed knowledge that others didn’t. They knew how to build things. So they were determined to keep that knowledge secret and communicate with each other using coded messages, symbolism, metaphor, allegory, etc. It is that legacy of secret communication that modern Masons preserve and use.

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  6. Your Post Bob

    ….. he compares the long green grass to his daughters flowing hair. i’m bringing sheep shears to the chase victory party so FF can cut off my hair and donate it to Locks of Love for a cancer patient. well, if i have any hair left by then.

    ………………………………………………………..

    We’re going today on a hunt – he placed the “cable cutters” there – and wants them back – Victory Party sounds terrific. Love and hugs to all of you………. 🙂 🙂 🙂

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  7. bob:
    geydelkon- ok all my hair is pulled out. are you sure the word on top of the chest is main? i dont think so. because that would mean the word main is placed on the lid upside down, away from you as you open the lid. rather i believe the letters IN will be NI…..
    this is how the word appears when facing the chest. it has to be NI and something else like NIGH or NIGHT. or a name labeling the owner of the chest like NIVEN.
    the end is ever drawing nigh.
    could mean that the end is opening the chest with the word nigh. drawing, or pulling towards you, the lid. which is how it is at the display because the chest faces away from the railing protecting the display so that no one can stumble over it.
    luckily, my hair grows back quickly. lol

    Well Bob, What can I say to make you believe that is says MAIN? You can call my wife she will verify that is what it says. I am looking at whole different area like everyone else. Have you searched Colorado?

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    • Gey –

      What would the marking of MAIN on the chest, mean ? Does it represent a company? Where did that chest come from – is it a strong box and why is it in the Draper?

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      • Good morning INTO. I don’t know much about the box. On the wooden box is a colorful backpack that is secured to the top. The backpack does not look like it belongs there because it does not fit the scene. Forrest Fenn had a hand in the design and layout of many of the displays. I would say he was a consultant.

        Anyway, check or this page. Go down to 2014.
        titletothegold.com/treasure-blogs/forrest-fenn-hidden-treasure/forrest-fenn-videos/

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        • Well – regarding the Draper – we know that FF said it is not there……..No, I will not find where he said that …….

          Gey – that was a neat video of the pipe – and one I had not seen before – how ever did you find that? Do you know how we can see the full version?

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          • Into, I have the full video. It is in private mode and the only way people can see it if they sign up on titletothegold.com There have been signups daily and they will have access soon.
            I know the chest is not at the Draper and Forrest is correct. He is funny that way.
            What I have learned about Forrest is that he is a great guy and could be a super great friend to have no matter what. I wish I was born 30 years earlier to meet up with him on the banks. We really think the same on many levels.
            Forrest I got your back.

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  8. GeyDELkon:
    Hey Bob,
    Do you want me to send you another picture of the treasure to you or would like for me to post it on titletothegold.com for everyone?

    Anyway, I was out and about today. I had some guy following me today. Darn, I thought I took the back roads to become silent in the mountains. I seen a young lady jogging by my campsite. It was cold around the low 40?s I guess. I think she was in a hurry to get somewhere. Yet, I moved faster than she did.

    So allow me to show you what my statement above means. It is very similar to all my statements I post on all the blogs. Forrest quotes and statements follow the same pattern.

    My campsite is my hotel room. Outside my door is a exercise room with a young lady running on a treadmill as I walked away. Somewhere in the rocky mountains.

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  9. bob:
    into- you are so right about the florida heat. and i bring the heat when it comes to searching for FF treasure. did i mention the blaze is feet? oh yes, i did. has FF ever said anything about dogs? you know, dogs being slang for feet. anybody gettin warmer now? the chest in question is next to Harold McCracken’s feet. step on a crack. Geydelkon has the photo.

    bob:
    into- you are so right about the florida heat. and i bring the heat when it comes to searching for FF treasure. did i mention the blaze is feet? oh yes, i did. has FF ever said anything about dogs? you know, dogs being slang for feet. anybody gettin warmer now? the chest in question is next to Harold McCracken’s feet. step on a crack. Geydelkon has the photo.

    Hey Bob,
    Do you want me to send you another picture of the treasure to you or would like for me to post it on titletothegold.com for everyone?

    Anyway, I was out and about today. I had some guy following me today. Darn, I thought I took the back roads to become silent in the mountains. I seen a young lady jogging by my campsite. It was cold around the low 40’s I guess. I think she was in a hurry to get somewhere. Yet, I moved faster than she did.

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    • Gey –

      I thought you might find it today .. how did the hunt go – any progress?

      It’s cold out there if your campin……hope you have a heater or two.

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      • Hello bob,

        When we stopped by the museum from our trip to Yellowstone for our honeymoon, I did take a few pictures. I really don’t have a picture of what you are talking about or what it is. Unless, you are talking about the display with the word IN on the box. Actually, the box says MAIN. I will post a picture of it on Titletothegold.com website Pintrest pictures.

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        • hey gey, thats interesting you were able to read the whole word. when I first visited the museum* in 2013 the backpack on the chest wasn’t fastened down. and I could open the lid because it wasn’t locked. I didnt bother to read the whole word. after I looked into the chest I quickly closed it and replaced the backpack so that only the letters IN were exposed.
          jump to april of this year, I returned to the museum* to see if everything was just as I left it and it was. only this time, the backpack is fastened in such a way so that only the letters IN are exposed. and, the lid to the chest is now screwed shut.
          why is it important that the letters IN should be exposed on that wood lid I wonder. especially with all those wild animals around keeping watch.
          it must have some significance to someone associated to that museum*

          *Draper museum of natural history.

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          • Hello Bob,

            Well you have to be BOLD in order to find the things like I have found and nobody hasn’t because maybe one may be awarded the penalty of death. Don’t pull you hair out thinking it being in the Draper museum. The words in the poem will tell you exactly where it is. The first stanza is a visual of where its at. Just horrifying though and I cant get it off my mind.

            Bob, I do recall the chatter on this blog about “IN” on the box. Well it says “MAIN”.

            Funny thing, I do know the names of many of the people who have solved the first two clues and went right by where the treasure is. I think you might be on the list but I am not sure. You should email me of where you have been exactly in all the 4 states and I will tell you if you made the list.

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          • geydelkon- ok all my hair is pulled out. are you sure the word on top of the chest is main? i dont think so. because that would mean the word main is placed on the lid upside down, away from you as you open the lid. rather i believe the letters IN will be NI…..
            this is how the word appears when facing the chest. it has to be NI and something else like NIGH or NIGHT. or a name labeling the owner of the chest like NIVEN.
            the end is ever drawing nigh.
            could mean that the end is opening the chest with the word nigh. drawing, or pulling towards you, the lid. which is how it is at the display because the chest faces away from the railing protecting the display so that no one can stumble over it.
            luckily, my hair grows back quickly. lol

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  10. I have been reading, rereading this chapter and focusing on the paragraph just before the poem and this has been puzzling me. The George Burns quote.
    1- The quote is not by George Burns but by Roy Acuff. And the actual quote is
    “My health is good; it’s my age that’s bad”
    2- The punctuation after “good”. The original has ‘;’, but in ttotc it is a ‘,’.

    any comments?

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      • thanks into. I feel this is not related to the starting point but maybe related to the gypsy magic chapter.

        maybe the list of colors are related to the starting spot.

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    • UA- yet another fact written wrong. notice FF uses as many references to fire, heat, blazes as he can throughout TTOTC. george BURNS is another one. obviously, THE BLAZE spoken of in the poem has nothing to do with fire. I think. the blaze is feet.

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      • I am a little lost with these “facts written wrong”. I know it is a hint but how do you determine where the hint is? Does FF want us to correct the fact?

        any ideas?

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        • UA –

          Don’t mind Bob – he lives in Florida and the heat got him. lol

          Here is how I related to a hint – and a clue – it has to have been – either said or written by Fenn. It has to pass my gut feeling first. Secondly it has to have at least three solid leads that are either in the book – an interview – the poem or a scrapbook. If it has one good lead – I don’t use it ..I feel it should have more. Of course everyone has there own ways of seeing things and I’m not saying my way is correct – but it hasn’t failed me yet. I always thought it was better to be correct in the beginning rather than end up with a bunch of usless papers that are meaningless. Try to stay organized. I have a paper clip method – all like things put together. Then when I want to add to it – it’s easy to find. Some of my best thoughts came from re-organizing paper work. I have been through four reams of solid white paper… I like it because lines – I find confining.
          I can’t draw on lined paper or trace from it.

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          • thanks into, you sound like a very well organized person and the information you give is appreciated.

            So just to make sure I understand , not all the “facts written wrong” are hints? Because majority of the quotes that are in the book are not by the person that FF says.

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          • UA – I don’t really know how to answer you without miss leading you.

            First – I don’t think FF makes mistakes. As many of the quotes are wrong – some of them worked for me and some didn’t. For instance – Roy Akuff and George Burns didn’t help me. It could be the “age” thing he is pointing to. My advice is don’t worry about the clues that don’t work – go until you find some that do. First find the start and then find the home of Brown……don’t worry about too much else at this point. With those two nailed – you should be dancing around the room.

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          • into- you are so right about the florida heat. and i bring the heat when it comes to searching for FF treasure. did i mention the blaze is feet? oh yes, i did. has FF ever said anything about dogs? you know, dogs being slang for feet. anybody gettin warmer now? the chest in question is next to Harold McCracken’s feet. step on a crack. Geydelkon has the photo.

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          • Hi Bob –

            Yes bring on the heat – let it blaze……….

            Ahhhh yes, feet – two feet down. I’d better get kraken.

            I’ll prolly (that’s a Chris Yates word) need a blow torch at this point.

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          • Oh my –

            If you are going to bury something and protect it from a temperature change – 18 inches is how far down it should be. At that depth level the soil does not change even in a fire – so if we add the six inches of the box to 18 – we get TWENTY FOUR – two happy feet. 🙂 🙂

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          • I am looking only at this chapter and nowhere else at the moment.
            I remember reading a comment from you to find the difference in the poem between the FF’s website and the book.

            I believe the web page has a title (the poem) and the book does not.

            I am not sure what kind of a title is “the poem”; maybe a place holder until the actual title is written. And why does the poem in the book not have a title? the answers ….. I do not know yet.

            Also, without knowing the area, how can someone figure out what the hints/clues are pointing to? I am thinking once the spot is found, the hints become easy to point. However, the starting location must be spelled out somehow, someway. Am i correct?

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          • Hi UA –

            Geez – I thought you had it the other day……

            You have to have courage to just plunge into what you think may be wrong. And what’s right in front of you.
            Courage my friend. Go ahead and find if you are right. You also at this point could look for the home of Brown…… Remember we are looking at 2009 – things change………

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          • UA- one reason the poem is untitled may be because it leads us so many places. the poem deserves hundreds of titles. each of us has our own title. my personal favorite would be….”Ode to the Draper Museum of Natural History”
            what would you title the poem? FF does give us the freedom to title.

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  11. Imo, when FF talks about the Captain Kidd and looking for the treasure, he is hinting about a lost treasure which I believe can be linked to the “hints of riches old” line in the poem.

    Does anybody know a good web site to search for old treasure locations?

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    • UA –

      To search all the lost treasures would be a daunting task for sure. So, you might want to narrow it down to your specific area ………. I really do believe Forrest has tied everything to an area. Again, you can see – how very important your start point is.

      PS – if you don’t find any lost treasures in your area – you might be in the wrong place.

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        • You are driving down the road in your car on a wild, stormy night, when you pass by a bus stop and you see three people waiting for the bus:

          1. An old lady who looks as if she is about to die.
          2. An old friend who once saved your life.
          3. The perfect partner you have been dreaming about.

          Knowing that there can only be one passenger in your car, whom would you choose?

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          • There is always a solution.
            Let the old friend drive the old lady and I will have the perfect night with my dreamy partner.
            everybody wins.

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          • yes UA – that’s the answer –

            Do you see the pieces of the puzzle? Rather than think outside the box – throw the box aside for a moment —– and look elsewhere to find where to start. One of the most important things you could know about Forrest is – he’s a people person.

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          • UA –

            Since the start – is so important – I want you to get it right. I think I’ve adopted you…..lol. Forrest said read the poem and read the book – over and over…. perhaps he didn’t mean the whole book – just the part about the poem……….. and you know to look in a special area………….this is going to be an area close and meaningful to Forrest (but you may find that out later) for a very specific reason…….so there are lists to guide you….don’t be lookin at state lists …..cuz it’s not there. Do not go onto other things until you get this right – other than the HOB. It’s is possible to find that first and work backwards – but highly unlikely unless you know the area well.

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          • UA –
            BTW – when you do find it – I am sure you can think of a truly inventive way of letting me know….

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  12. The Wolf:
    Ok I found that chapter and posted it.I was too busy to proof read it so let me know if there are errors. Thanks all for supporting cancer research.

    www.findingfenn.com/#!Does-the-Treasure-Contain-Clues/cam/56070c620cf2375d99dde490

    So many have mentioned that the contents in the chest have a connection to the 9 clues. The nine clues are rock solid but I can not make any connection at all to the chest. Time for more deep thinking. Two different locations with two different worlds.

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  13. I am one of the few who thinks the treasure itself could be important to the search. I believe he mentions some items for a reason. I dont want to influence anyone thinking though. We all have our own ideas about the whole process.

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      • I looked for references to a dragons coat bracelet and could not find any mention of one anywhere.

        I looked more at the items as a trail. You have the mention of the Wetherill bracelet, the box with ladders, the mention of the carved animal fetish necklace from the South American jungle. There was also gold in both old form, nuggets and dust and the new form of coins. There were jewels, I am assuming cut stones, carved jade faces, hammered gold mirrors, and a spanish gold and emerald ring
        . In my mind all these things
        could be related.

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          • well looks like another aberration is the way Eric Sloane died. Book says he died waiting at the red light, which is not true. Researching Sloane now.

            Maybe warm waters halt at the red light.

              (Quote)

          • There are various accounts on where he died. The steps of the Plaza Hotel, the corner, the sidewalk, the hospital….

            In NY city all those things are very close to a red light.

            If you have found something different let me know…..

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          • Wolf –

            You just helped to put the aberration together for me…….Thanks.

            Red lights – atom bomb – the Manhattan project – WW2

              (Quote)

          • Maybe Sloane’s death is not an aberration since like into said, there are many different reports on that.

            What is the “hat” aberration Wolf?

            Also what is up with the usage of the word “old” in the book as well as in the poem? I mean it is used over and over and over again. Is he hinting to passage of time?

              (Quote)

        • im pretty sure FF used the word aberration once and used it improperly and since then, many have used the word improperly as well.

          definition- a departure from what is normal, usual, or expected, typically one that is unwelcome.

          so these “facts written wrong” (from ttotc) are not aberrations. these are just more puzzle pieces to Where The Treasure LIES!

            (Quote)

    • I had a chapter written for my book on just that topic. Really interesting with the Richard Weatherill connection and many other things. When FF said the contents where not related to the clues(paraphrase) I removed it from the book. But that still left the chest alone to signal the location. That I did go into detail in the book. The ladders were the cool part.

        (Quote)

  14. In this chapter regarding the history of the necklace, F says that Richard Wetherill sold it to Fred Harvey in 1901. The Wiki says Fred Harvey died in 1901. Is this an aberration?

    Do you think there is something here?

      (Quote)

        • I always felt that was an aberration as well. Wetherill is spelled “Wetherell” in the TTOTC.

          The subtle hint in TTOTC – “In the spring when the weather was warm” is the beginning but it is also the end.

          Hint of Riches new and old. Many focus on “new and old” as the hint but “Riches” as in the name is the hint (IMO). Rich Wetherill is the hint and Fenn’s use of “weather” is interesting. In fact, I believe the owner of the land in which the treasure lies is hinted by this. FF further hinted it with the 10,200 comment.

          What is at 10,200? Comet Mountain. Who sang the the Comet cleanser jingle? Josephine the plumber (Jane Withers) “Comet tastes like gasoline” which is almost identical to “porcupines taste like kerosine” Further, kerosine is used in helicopters as fuel, which is named after the brave and in the wood – “Tarhe” who came from the porcupine clan (Wyandot tribe). Thus the hint/aberration “indecision is the key to flexibility” which is actually coined from the airforce phrase – “airpower is the key to flexibility”

          So what does this all mean? The owner of the land is Jean Withers. How is that for a coincidence that matches very nicely to the end cycling back to the beginning.

            (Quote)

    • UA –

      Actually he could have sold it to Harvey in 1901 – as he wasn’t murdered until Feb. of that year.

      Here is a great website on the happenings of the day he was murdered. Make sure you take a look at the things the side bar has to offer….like the pictographs. Then tell me if you think that stone on pg 95 matches.

      wetherillfamily.com/murder_of_richard_wetherill.htm

      So, that would make this bracelet – very special indeed.

        (Quote)

      • indeed an interesting story. Have not researched all the links yet but will. Do you think, how Fred Harvey got the bracelet is important and relevant or F wanted people to learn about Wetherill only?

          (Quote)

        • UA –

          I do know that the story – certainly creates an interest in not only the bracelet – but other items in the chest too.

          I did find only one thing – Mrs Wetherill was talking and said if you ate a Harvey House – that it was a big deal.

          Do I think this info will move you closer to the treasure – no I don’t.

            (Quote)

      • It is very curious. the stone looks very much similar. similar shape.
        On an other note I also think that the abberation was not the spelling of Wetherill since on the marker it is written as Wetherell. The abberation was the year 1901 and the bracelet. imo.

        Just to cross check this, how would someone arrive here just from the poem? Wolf mentioned the line (riches new and old) might be pointing to Richard but without the book , one cannot make the connection.

        And the million $ question …..what does it all mean? What do you do with this information?
        I think i will let this simmer

          (Quote)

        • UA –

          Yes, that stone is the same – and such an odd shape for a stone.

          It’s close to where Geronimo’s Warm Springs starts…… someone might want to take a look at that area… I won’t be doing that.

          It seems that things he placed in the chest – all have meanings to him. This one he wants back.

          If you take a look at the gold bead necklace – given to him by Wolfgang Pogzeba (who’s wife was a national level ice skater, and who’s family goes back generations into art) both (along with their little son) were killed in an airplane crash……..

          Now we have three extremely meaningful items to Forrest.

          1. Eric Slones coat bracelet
          2. Pogzeba’s gold beads
          3. Wetherill’s turquois bead bracelet

            (Quote)

  15. I was reading the old posts and came across this particular one and this thread is quite interesting. Looking at the pg 43 are you talking about the illustration or the picture?

      (Quote)

    • UA –

      I’m not quite sure who you are talking to –

      And I’m not sure how to answer the question if you were speaking to me – what do you want to know and I’ll try to help……………

        (Quote)

      • into,
        in fact i was responding to your post. 🙂

        I was curious regarding your reply to Bob about the plaque and the hint on page 43. Wondering the hint was in the photo or the illustration.

        thanks

          (Quote)

        • I think there is a picture of a wagon train – near.

          I saw a connection between The Main Street Cowboys and who I thought this chapter represented. It’s was someone who wore a cowboy hat all the time…………… and I have since changed my mind.

          You see – I think each of the dancers in the drawing can be identified as a real person. Some are still alive and some are not. The clues are in the poem as to who they are……..

          If you google – ttotc gypsy magic drawing – you can bring up the old thread where – there are some really interesting things on that drawing. Those where fun times when we were doing those things. VGBOSS was so great – and such a help. Now, nobody believes these things as important…….. except maybe Mindy is getting it – finally.

          So, tell me about you –

            (Quote)

          • Oh some of us have always believed but were keeping it close to the vest.

            Remember its not what they say on the blogs its what they whispered?

              (Quote)

          • Are you hiding a secret, Deb? I have been trying to listen to the whispers, but I must confess that it’s difficult because of all the shouting on the blogs sometimes. I really enjoy the peace I find here…and the most excellent art found at the top of the page. 🙂

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  16. spallies:
    Imagine people as snowflakes….especially this time of year so many are in the frieze…:)Hope you all get warmer weather soon…

    E* & Spallies – thanks for responding to my out of the box Snowflake analogy. It was more of a metaphor than clue solution. I do believe wwwh is frozen in time and also a reference to tears in Forrest’s poem. Salt crystals as in human tears form square crystals because the molecules stack differently. So wwwh could be a square solution in the poem’s architecture if referring to tears or a hex shape solve of referring to ice crystals. No ideas on how to apply that. Just ideas.

    E* a truly amazing study on emotions and snowflakes! I love their intricate lacy beauty, and also found ‘peace’ the most eye pleasing. “The Secret Life of a Snowflake” by Kenneth Libbrecht is a favorite book of mine. www.amazon.com/The-Secret-Life-Snowflake-Snowflakes/dp/0760336768

      (Quote)

    • Thanks Lia, I love all the beautiful pics in that book. I might have to do another Amazon order soon… I really enjoyed Eric Sloane’s The Little Red Schoolhouse. Thanks again to whoever here recommended it… Sorry, I can’t remember… was it you Lia?

      Oh I almost forgot… yes the “Peace” was my favorite as well.. But, it always is…

        (Quote)

        • E* if you pay book rate shipping I’m happy to lend you both The Red School House and Secret Life of Snowflakes. When Sloanes books were recommended I purchased a few of his paper back’s and have truly enjoyed them. Just tell me where to ship and you may enjoy them too 🙂

          Off topic, but as a young gal my family’s favorite restaurant was called The Red Schoolhouse. Run by a Sweedish lady and her daughters on a beautiful lake; blue willow dishes on white tablecloths with the best home made cooking. Only open in the summertime – which made it worth the cold wait!

            (Quote)

          • lia – Was that restaurant on Flathead Lake?:

            Thanks for the offer on the books. I may take you up on that someday. 🙂

              (Quote)

  17. E*:
    inthechaseto and lia – Imagine how people and their emotions,…can affect the formation of a water crystal:

    My favorite is “Peace”.

    Wow, that was profound. Thank You E*! Peace was beautiful. 🙂

      (Quote)

    • LOL. I love those babies! Watching them talk and the hand gestures, can you imagine what they will be like as adults? Their mom will be wishing for the days before they started speaking. Hahahaha

        (Quote)

    • vgboss – Note that one of babies is missing a sock,…on his right foot,…which leads me to believe that they are discussing one of life’s great mysteries,…”What happened to the OTHER sock?” I don’t think Stephen Hawking has figured that one out,…yet. But it could involve a Black Hole….

      www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUpl0HDGq1Q

        (Quote)

      • Thanks for sharing that, E*. It’s interesting how a movie about a brilliant person…with his incredible abilities and disabilities…and his “Theory of Everything” precipitates a simple truth.

        LOVE IS EVERYTHING .

        How infinitely rich are those who learn that lesson in their lifetime…especially at the beginning.

          (Quote)

        • Thanks gang, Looks like an excellent movie!! Plan to rent it tonight. LOVE & HOPE = life without limits!

          Hi VGboss, I don’t believe we’ve met but I agree life without adult psychobabble is the best. Baby video is great, and I’m back in kid world of solving the poem. I swing between too serious and total goof ball 😉

            (Quote)

          • Et tu, Lia? I swing between sage and fool on a regular basis. It’s like I always say…laugh or cry… (short pause…staring) …laugh or cry. I patiently wait for the day when I can do both …simultaneously …and my tears are only tears of joy. But I suppose I wouldn’t be the man I am today without a heapin’ helpin’ of both joy and pain. I could say I didn’t “sign up for this”, but I’ll bet when it’s all through that “Someone” will show me a contract…or something…where I signed up for this. 🙂

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  18. Bob:
    No I don’t Spallies (flakes lol). I worded that post to mislead, good catch. I’m in Florida and it is cold here.

    Bob are you feeding the goldfish again? Feed mine while you are at it , please? Dont carp at me, I said please…..

      (Quote)

    • Announcer: You are watching cable access channel 9 Aurora Colorado.

      (FF on guitar)
      (Dal with drumsticks)(not chicken)
      (Guitar riffs)
      FENNS WORLD!
      FENNS WORLD!!
      Excellent! Excellent!
      WOOO! Wooo! Wooo!
      Grrrrr!

      FF- “search on Dal.”
      Dal- “search on Forrest.”
      Both- “all right!”

      FF- “hello, I’m your excellent host Forrest Fenn, and with me is Dal Neitzel. Tonight we have as our esteemed guest, you know him as Bob, get out here Bob!”

      FENNS WORLD!
      FENNS WORLD!
      Wooo, Wooo Wooo!

      FF- Welcome to Fenn’s world Bob! Got a clue?

      (FF and Dal snicker)

      Bob- what?

      FF- I said, puzzled searcher sez whut?

      Bob- What?

      FF-puzzled searcher sez whut?

      (FF and Dal snicker)

      FF- thank you Bob! Moving on! (FF looks serious) now Bob, you claim to have taken the chest and gone in peace.
      Dal- NOT!
      FF- Please (laughing) explain to me how that is working for you? (Dal laughing)

      Bob- well Forrest, you see I believe that line of the poem “just take the chest”…. Means a photo.

      FF- so Bob, when Indiana Jones raided the lost ark, he just “took a photo”? And when Neil Armstrong went to the moon, he didn’t walk on it? He just “took a photo”? (Dal laughing) and I suppose when Queen Isabella commissioned Christopher Columbus to sail off the edge of the earth, she just WANTED A PHOTO? Huh Bob is that what you are telling me? (Dal laughing holding thumb and forefinger in shape of letter L to forehead.

      Bob- I, I, ….

      FENNS WORLD!
      FENNS WORLD!
      Excellent!
      Wooo! Wooo! Wooo!

      FF- well Bob you’re just a big dummy.
      Dal- As if!
      FF- search on Dal!
      Dal- search on Forrest!

      FF- that’s all the time we have for tonight, join us next week our guest will be Victor!

      Dal- (mocking) oh honey, I can’t wait!
      (Both laughing)

        (Quote)

      • Bob – After reading Victor’s posts,…over at Dal’s,….I think the word that is Key,…in the Poem,…is “Glucose”:

        The hexagon is associated with many forms in nature, such as crystals, snowflakes, the cells of a honeycomb or the disposition of the elements in the organic matter, even DNA….

        Hexagon,…six sided,…and F is the sixth letter of the alphabet…

          (Quote)

        • Hello there Inthechase & E*
          Since you are discussing hexagons in nature, here’s a different idea than I’ve seen paired. All snowflakes are formed when a microscopic speck of dirt acts as a nucleus falling through the atmosphere, hexagonal crystals form around the dirt to form a snowflake. In essence snow could be both home of brown and wwwh. The snowflake metaphorically can represent redemption: our “dirt” is covered by the creator is a pure and beautiful way to make us new creatures wearing pure white robes which become a blazing blanket in the sunshine when we stick together.

            (Quote)

          • lia –

            It’s always fun and perhaps right, when people start thinking out of the box.

            Keep in mind, I have not seen a hint to hexagons other than what Victor posted.

            So, my question for you is – where do the snow flakes take you? Is there a hidden meaning I’m missing?

            I am keeping in mind that Forrest said the poem is straight forward.

            To me that means – one very real spot leads to another. No foolin around folks.

            That does not mean that the poem doesn’t have layers – and possibly two or three meanings to each clue.

            That does not mean that someone should not think out of the box. So you go girl.

            E*

            I do see that DNA is important as I do believe this entire chase is about people.

            Almost every scrapbook is about people.

            Every chapter in TTOTC is about people – and really – why not – Forrest is a people person and people make the world go round. 🙂

              (Quote)

          • Imagine people as snowflakes…. especially this time of year so many are in the frieze…:) Hope you all get warmer weather soon…

              (Quote)

  19. It’s cold here. Ouray, CO is known as the Swiss Alps of America.
    The Alps are the setting of “The Crystal Hunters” a novel by George Manville Fenn.
    Located north and slightly east of Santa Fe, Spain. In his book find an ice axe carrying character named Dale. An elderly guide named Melchior. Melchior was also the name of one of the gift bearing kingly visitors to the birth of Christ. Melchior brought gold. In Fenn’s novel Melchior and Dale guide a young boy into the Alps to search for gems, gold and silver. They encounter glaciers, ice cold rivers.
    They are welcome visitors to a pine brown chalet, where cows are milked.
    They find treasures and encounter difficulties in keeping them.

      (Quote)

      • Inthechaseto- so your home of brown is a chalet?

        Chalet

        I like that word. Sounds cool when I say it…chalet.

        I got a nice little chalet just south of St. Augustine.

        That sounds sophisticated.

        What? My home? It’s a quaint chalet in a sleepy village by the ocean.

        WOW!

          (Quote)

        • He Bob, Do you live in Ouray? It’s on my Bucket list… One of the first locations I researched… I didn’t find the treasure but I fell in love with the town…:)

            (Quote)

          • No I don’t Spallies (flakes lol). I worded that post to mislead, good catch. I’m in Florida and it is cold here.

              (Quote)

        • Bob – That’s OK,…the Carp are getting their revenge:

          www.greatriver.com/natural/FLYING%20CARP/flying_carp.htm

          www.youtube.com/watch?v=jb8OmEr7VqI

          Imagine if you can, 10-20 lb fish jumping into your boat as you idle in a side channel of the Mississippi River. A classic fish story, but one that has Illinois River Fishermen dodge a flying Asian carp. (photo by CBS news) Bighead and Silver Asian Carp will leap violently out of the water when disturbed by boaters. The man in lower left is holding out a NET in hopes of CATCHING a flying carp. There are fishing contests now on the Illinois River… but fishing poles are not allowed… fish must be caught in a NET. CBS CHICAGO ran a special video, available online, showing the boats dashing around trying to catch the flying carp!!become true in the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers. In reality, it is a situation than can be downright hazardous especially when a 20-lb fish comes flying at your head. Biologists from the Long Term Resource Monitoring Program have reported being hit multiple times by large jumping fish on the Mississippi River north of St. Louis while electrofishing to sample fish populations. Unfortunately, the fish in this case is the bighead carp, not exactly the fish of dreams, because they have little or no value as a game fish.

          “I’ve got a buddy of mine that got hit in the head less than a couple of weeks ago and knocked him out cold in the boat.” Craig Sondker, fisherman

            (Quote)

          • E- I hate carps! They can ruin a good bass lake. My buddies and I used to bowfish and kill as many as we could. Leave them lying on the bank for possums and raccoons to eat. Drum too…you are correct they are not gamefish, mud sucking demons. Trash fish. The only good carp, is a dead carp.
            I’d love to be in that boat with those guys on the Mississippi, with a baseball bat, knocking them out of the park. Lol

              (Quote)

          • That’s great, Inthechaseto. It seems that back-handed fly fishing would work great on a river lined with trees when you want to cast straight out…and not get snagged in the trees. You could cast directly into a gap/space between the trees…which would be a lot easier to do if you’re looking straight at it or standing in the center between the trees. Brilliant! 🙂

              (Quote)

    • Scrapbook 36 I think it was, Forrest has a girl standing by a huge rhododendron. In The Crystal Hunters, rhododendron is mentioned in the first chapter. So somebody must have emailed FF about that book and all the coincidences to TTOTC treasure hunt. I just thought I’d throw it out because I haven’t seen anyone else do it yet.

        (Quote)

      • Thanks Bob…
        I just read the last chapter and the first about the wild rhodies… George is a very talented story teller… I think I will read the rest of it…:)

          (Quote)

      • Oh it could be just about anything, dendron is the Greek root word that means tree. You would be suprised how many words are related by root words throughout history. I certainly was. 🙂

          (Quote)

  20. The frog on the map page 133 is a hint to Dennis Hopper and the house he owned, the mud palace. The nuggets around the frog are mountains around Taos.

    Miss Ford fits here too as the mud palace was built by Mabel DODGE luhan.

    The gap between the nuggets at approximate 2:00 is the mountain pass that leads to eagle nest.

      (Quote)

    • And so the gold coin under the frog is representative of “put in below the home of brown” but the bronze box is not in the basement of the mud palace, this simply implies to “put in” Taos creek.

        (Quote)

        • I don’t know about all the ideas that Bob discovers, but some of them are very plausible. I still think that Forrest wouldn’t look far from the state that he “treasures” …New Mexico. I’ve been guarding this idea for quite a while, but I figure I’ll share it now since I think it would be nice if the bronze chest is found in Forrest’s lifetime. I had an idea quite a while ago that “the blaze” has something to do with the Trinity test site. Ground zero at the site is 4,900 ft…which I think is more than a coincidence. The location is only open ONE day a year…but maybe Forrest placed the treasure just outside of the restricted access area…say 11 feet higher at 5001 ft. altitude. You know, they tested the world’s first nuclear bomb there, right? “The end is ever drawing nigh”? Like I said, I was guarding that intel for a few years, but thought I’d finally share it…since I’ve benefited from others over the years.

          www.tripadvisor.com/LocationPhotoDirectLink-g60933-d124544-i64644301-Trinity_Site-Albuquerque_New_Mexico.html#64415908

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  21. FF gives us the lat and long coordinates in Gold And More…”And then I got cancer. After a one (1) hour operation turned into five(5), my doctor said I had a 20% (2) chance of living three(3) years.”

    1523
    Add a zero gets- 105.23
    And a partial percent sign- 105.23* (my phone won’t give me a degree symbol, asterisk instead)

    Continuing…..”At age fifty-eight I had spent more than nineteen years asleep,”

    58-19=39
    58+19=77

    39.77*

    Coordinates of lookout mountain Colorado are 105.2386W 39.76N
    Bill cody gravesite

    Thanks Bur!

      (Quote)

    • Hello Bob, FF is an amazing writer…no doubt about that. I really question sometimes, though, when other people take his words and do their “best” to make them fit a certain place…come hell or high water.

      On second thought, I really can’t say anything about what others do because I’ve done it many times myself. You know, John 8:7, and all.

      www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+8%3A7&version=KJV

      If everyone lived their life by those words there wouldn’t be ANY stone throwing…now would there.

      And regarding my own, personal abilities to write “a theme”…in my mind it’s kinda like the video below…and then I wake up! 🙂

      Simply click on this “thing” that shows videos:

      www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8L86Z8YgeQ

        (Quote)

      • Deb- star date 4-17-14 captains log…
        1.childrens winter hat black and green
        2. Power line insulator possible antique
        3. Several old containers of tin construction approx 4″ tall 2″ in diameter for portage if adult cereal malt beverage
        4. Abandon gold mine
        5. Steel box in ground of unknown origin.
        6. Geocache
        7. A small, girls purse empty void of any clue of previous owner.
        8. A yellow fuzzy sphere used in the activity commonly known as “tennis” but since no courts in vicinity it was determined that an owner if a dog lost the sphere in a game known as “fetch”.
        9. A bottle of “pain killers”…now this discovery was most interesting. In a man-made pile of stones, an old pill bottle full of wadded up pieces of paper. On each piece of paper were printed words of encouragement for the finder. Much like fortune cookies. Bur and I read a couple, and put it back where we found it. Obviously, part of a church group scavenger hunt.
        10. I give you the treasure….

          (Quote)

        • Cool ! All I usually find is peoples trash. Shame on them ! I think I will start leaving little miniature dolls I bought years ago. At least if a kid finds it they will laugh. 🙂

            (Quote)

          • DEB’, Are your dolls going to be made of poop you find; we could set them on the rocks for the race route for all the joggers to admire and have a sign that says; SNIFF FOR LUCK! HA HA and have a hidden camera to take a picture of there noses.

              (Quote)

    • Martin luther had a dream too, but not 19 years i don’t think but maybe, i know i always slept in Algibra cause i wrote the dam book, but i could have dreamed that too and press as in depressed causeed me to for a while to sleep 20 hours out of 24 for about 2 years. I think the teasure can be in two places at the same time, but one is in spirit.

        (Quote)

  22. Okay can the “ball of string” be related in some way to Bill Cody, you bet cha. Forrest in theTTOTC book wrote…”Then I started collecting string, soon I had a multi colored ball”…In a famous letter sent to Buffalo Bill Cody by a boy after his death in 1917 saying: Dear Sir – my grandpa told me this morning you were ready to start for the happy hunting grounds. He said a long time ago they had perhaps given you ” the end of a golden string and told you to wind it into a ball”…. Robert Curtiss Talbott. Huh- Bur

      (Quote)

    • Inthechaseto, have I said anything to maybe get you taste buds going yet, I know you said you didn’t see nothing in Cody general description to get you interested. Well since this is “Gold” and more there is certainly more. How about something that pertains to the poem? But there is still more in the book and with comments Forrest made on post and Cody himself. Okay I’ll take a break just in case people are researching my posts and Cody. I would like to see some other posts from anyone about things that could be kind of related to Cody if your researching. Heck I might not of caught them all and I’m sure I haven’t. Any thoughts? Bur

        (Quote)

      • Bur- my thoughts are a hundred of us searchers should converge on lookout mountain with shovels and not stop digging until they call it “lookout flats”. And then, once we have exposed Bill Cody’s bronze casket we can take it to Cedar mountain and give him proper burial. Maybe that’s what this is all about. The ghost of W.F.Cody is working through FF to move his body where he wanted it. I can see him now, lying in the casket, tapping his heels and repeating….”there’s no place like home!” We can organize the event after the conference in Santa Fe in October. And Bur? If you are not sure of proper attire for the conference, check out my posts at blog buzz. My research is thorough. Follow my lead, you will look stunning.

          (Quote)

        • Bob you will need a good jack hammer too because of all the concrete poured on top of his casket to keep them Wyoming folk from trying to steal it. Some say it’s a look a like buried there and B.B.C is really buried in a secret location on Ceder Mountain but others that new him say it’s his body that was placed in his final rest place. Ask a mason. Bur (awful quite here is it something I said?)

            (Quote)

    • Ball of string; DAMN, that would hurt wraped tight around; i didn’t know CODY WAS CASTURATED at the funeral home and that the imbomer’s sister was impegnated by Cody earlier that same year; how terrifying it must have been for the poor woman; to get his balls in the mail

        (Quote)

  23. Hey Bob, that’s a great idea to think about. 🙂
    I am not a member of the A team. I’m a member of the F troop. lol
    No treasure, just lots of fun getting there. 🙂

      (Quote)

  24. inthechaseto:
    No – but close

    Inthechaseto- thank you for that respose….”no- but close”.

    Here, you have given us all a very fine example of how NOT to conduct yourself at the conference in Santa Fe. I am not wrong. You can’t say I’m wrong inthechaseto! If, according to my solution I feel that the words on page 15 contain a huge hint then you cannot tell me I’m wrong. Especially since you present no evidence whatsoever to the contrary. Consider this a lesson learned inthechaseto because at the conference, simply saying….”no, but close” will offend some. Of course I have no idea what the plaque says that you are referring to. I would like to know. Tell me then, how close was I?

    And to continue on my train of thought from this thread of comment for “Gold and More” …..after FF talks about Gardiner Island which has a long history of being private property, meaning he could not have just gone there to look for Kidds treasure without permission. And, more importantly it’s not there anymore anyway it was dug up shortly after it was buried. (See: Jemez/Deb) the next sentence is…”it scared me so bad I was jarred awake…” A reference to the jars and bells that are buried.
    So, to me but not inthechaseto, I feel the private property thing is a big issue not only because of Gardiners island but also it could have a very strong connection to the last line of the poem…”I give you title to the gold” as I’ve stated before that the treasure and the bronze box are two different things. Title to the gold is a direct reference to the bronze box. The treasure is public property, national parks.

      (Quote)

    • LOL Bob —

      First I am not at a conference – and don’t intend to go – as I would probably say too much. If I can afford to go to Santa Fe – I might as well go to my spot and give it one more college try.

      I don’t know if your right or wrong – just as I don’t know If I am right or wrong. Who knows – only the Phantom.

      I had a dear friend who collected bells – she had one of the largest collections in the country – she lived to be 102. Are bells good for you?

      You want a page number – here you go – 43.

        (Quote)

      • Inthechaseto- well if you’re not going to the conference, because you would say too much? Are bells good for me? Page 43? I don’t understand any of that. I shouldn’t have taken your comment so seriously in the first place- “no-but close”. My mistake. Please continue your conversation with E*, never mind dumb ol me.
        (LOL)

          (Quote)

          • It is one of the blessings of old friends that you can afford to be stupid with them cuz you couldn’t afford the bill I would send – so it’s gratis.

              (Quote)

          • Inthechaseto- I just said send it didn’t say I was gonna pay it! Ha!
            Name your price, I’ll pay attention. Have been for a long time.

              (Quote)

          • Inthechaseto- I just said send it didn’t say I was gonna pay it! Ha!
            Name your price, I’ll pay attention. Have been for a long time.

              (Quote)

          • LOL – I heard you the first time Bob.

            So – we were talking about the plaque – you seemed to know which one I was talking about – the one where ff’s  treasure is secreted. The clue is – page 43 – IT is on the plaque.  I can’t find it anywhere on the net – so you will just have to go there to see it.  🙂

              (Quote)

          • Inthechaseto- I don’t know how my comment posted twice that’s never happened to me before. Anyway, if page 43 works for you then I’m happy. Here’s how page 15 works for me…it’s a plaque that describes the treasure of the stories in the memoir. Notice there is no little square box at the end of Important Literature. That chapter is not a part of the ball of string, or story thread. To summarize page 15: he is close to death and here is my life story. “So now I sit here past midnite” means later in life than most folks make it. “Beside my juniper fire” juniper fire is Peggy. “Reflecting back to the year when my awareness took it’s first few steps ” that’s the chapter First Grade . And then an asterisk. An oversize asterisk mind you. The word asterisk means little star. Stars burn white hot. An asterisk in a book means to look to the bottom of a page for additional meaning or clarification. The rest of TTOTC, after page 15 is a footnote. Or, look quickly down. Page 15 then is the trail marker, the path Forrest took in life to arrive at where he is now. The print on page 15 is large, like on a sign.

              (Quote)

          • HEY BHOB, wen’t you in that little piggy story and you went, WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE all the way home to play with your poop.

              (Quote)

        • Bob –

          Does page 43 work for me? It couldn’t be anymore glaring. It’s right in your face.

          In the beginning of the hunt – when people said it was about death – I thought how morbid and disregarded the notion. I know now, it is what this is all about. I have completed the solve and in the end – he tells why he did this – it’s very funny. Forrest has given us a good laugh at the end – just like him with his great sense of humor. I have found the poem to be very straight forward – as far as directions. I have found everything he has said – to be true. No trickery or subterfuge. Someone may not think so if they are in the wrong spot.

            (Quote)

  25. E*:
    inthechaseto – In reply to your comment:

    Sadly – he is no longer with us. If you only knew him – if he were still here –

    The old guard has changed and in his place –
    a new one.

    Can I just say AGAIN,…how much I miss vgboss?:

    www.ttotc.com/the-poem/stanza-3/#comment-390

    Check out the discussion about “your creek” being on Public Land.

    Thanks for reminding me of that E* I owe you one or two or three.

      (Quote)

    • inthechaseto – Glead to help,…if I can. 🙂

      vgboss mentioned Eric Sloane,…so I considered his thoughts on sound:

      “When Chinese firecrackers entered the scene, Independence Day bell-ringing vanished. But the thought of church bells and farm bells and school bells and fire bells all clanging through the countryside seems best to catch the spirit of that first American day. It would be fitting, it seems, to revive the bells of Independence Day.”
      -Eric Sloane, The Seasons of America Past

      www.common-place.org/vol-13/no-04/walthausen/

      In Sloane’s 1966 book The Sound of Bells, he complained about modern celebrations of Independence Day, and the loss of an old tradition—the ringing of bells to celebrate the Fourth of July. He dedicated his book to the cause of reviving the original Independence Day tradition of ringing bells rather than setting off fireworks. In the postscript, he wrote, “And if the revival of the early American custom of ringing bells on Independence Day will have become established, I would consider this one thing the most important occurrence connected with my life.”

      books.google.com/books?id=t1iAgGYVAKcC&pg=PA74&lpg=PA74&dq=Eric+Sloane+sound&source=bl&ots=MC-_325i95&sig=r2YR1UDSuBb3BIrpyX0oTOEjQKc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=kp7iU-TbCIzqoATp8YCQBQ&ved=0CGcQ6AEwDg#v=onepage&q=Eric%20Sloane%20sound&f=false

        (Quote)

      • E*

        Wasn’t he amazing? I wish I could have known him – and I truly wish we would have taken his advice to heart.

        Less Fires –

        Thanks for that – I will go back and read the whole thing – later in solitude. I want to relish it.

        Also – VGBOSS – I miss you too !!

          (Quote)

      • E- hey we need to meet at Waffle House the morning before the conference in Santa Fe. You, me, Zelda and luckydog. An A-team meeting to synchronize our watches, so to speak. That is assuming you will be at the conference.

          (Quote)

        • Bob – In the “Back to the Future” version of The Thrill of the Chase,…the A-Team has an incredible meeting,…with delicious waffles,…leading to the recovery of TC,…after arriving in the DeLorean,…at this cafe in Santa Fe (circa 1925):

            (Quote)

          • E- I bet they got good hot jacks, waffles and flap cakes…mmmm I can’t wait. I’ll do a conference on an empty brain, but not stomach, no way.

              (Quote)

          • Bob – I can’t remember,…was it you or me,…that came up with the idea to go back to that date in,…what was it,…2009 or 2010,…when Forrest hid TC at my spot? Whatever,…it doesn’t matter,…eating great waffles and laughing with good friends is what matters!!! 🙂

              (Quote)

    • yes I miss him too. By the way the idea wouldn’t do him any more good than it would me after Forrests latest post at Jenny’s .

      No hidden meaning in the poem.

        (Quote)

      • Deb- in his reply…..”no subterfuge in sight ”
        The word subterfuge means trickery, deception and it’s not in sight, it’s hidden. Hidden trickery. On a site aptly named mysterious writings. If there is no hidden meaning to the poem why is Jenny Kile involved at all? Forrest should be the guest on Sesame Street then, and 9 is the number of the day. Your solve is still awesome. Have you seen or heard of anyone going to your area to look?

          (Quote)

        • People have been going there since day one. lol Forrest told me my post caused lots of email to him. Then he said something about me having a “cult following” .LOL Too funny . He also said something about me being a pied piper . ROFL

            (Quote)

    • I did discuss with VG about that solve and him using it because the idea came from him to begin with, right here on this blog. You can probably find it if you look for it. But the difference is my solve involved Beowulf, stars and storytelling.
      He said it didn’t lead him to the chest either .

      Oh wait, I was brave enough to post my solve . 🙂

        (Quote)

  26. I think the dream about captain Kidd on Gardiners island means it’s buried on private property. If this has been discussed before I didn’t see it. But, I doubt there is a plaque marking the actual location, unless the plaque is about something else a marker of sorts. Like the one on Gardiners island a historical marker. And even that one, who knows if it’s the actual spot or a general location? Because the actual spot, was a hole and if they didn’t fill it in right away, it could have looked like a burrow. And they mistakenly placed the marker on a groundhogs den. I don’t know. It’s hard.

      (Quote)

    • I think your right Bob – it could be on private property – which indeedy will get you a trespassing ticket. It could also be on the boarder of Forest Service land and private property. I never thought about it relating to Gardiners Island – that’s a good one.

      On the way to my spot there is a plaque stating the history of the area. It talks about treasure – not FF’s treasure – another one.

      There are many different signs along the way –

      Keep digging – Bob !

        (Quote)

        • If he did make a deal with the landowner – wouldn’t the landowner be looking for it too?

          “Sound” is a very big clue – as the grizz is loud.

            (Quote)

          • inthechaseto – “Sound”,…”as the Grizz is loud”,…like when He/She is in a CAVE?:

            www.rulit.net/books/chitty-chitty-bang-bang-read-298020-9.html

            Suddenly Commander Pott seemed to listen carefully, and again he stopped the car and switched off the engine. And now they could all hear what he had heard-a frightening, eerie moaning that rose and fell and rose and fell and sent shivers down the spine.

            “What’s that?” they all asked, trying to keep their voices calm.

            Commander Pott leaned forward and unclipped the spotlight beside the windshield. It was one of the useful spotlights you can use at night as inspection lights and to read high-up road signs. He shone the light carefully up and along the roof of the cave until the beam came to a sort of contraption strung with shiny copper wires that was fixed into the chalk.

            Commander Pott laughed. “That’s an old trick,” he said cheerfully. “Someone really does want to scare people away from the cave. That’s a musical instrument called an aeolian harp, It’s much the same as an ordinary harp, only the strings or wires are much thinner so that even this small breeze blowing along them can make the strings sound this sort of moaning noise. It can get really spooky when the breeze varies and blows hard and soft in turns. I’ve seen them used before this-in ruined castles in Germany, to give the tourists a fright. Well, it hasn’t given these tourists a fright, has it?”

              (Quote)

          • Sadly – he is no longer with us. If you only knew him – if he were still here –

            The old guard has changed and in his place –
            a new one. 🙁

              (Quote)

          • E* – will figure it out – the great spirit willing.

            Bob – By the way – what do you suppose is on that plaque – have you found it – huge clue.

              (Quote)

          • Inthechaseto- which plaque? The one marking the spot where Kidd ‘s treasure was buried. The many which mark FF’s treasure. Or, the one marking FF’s bronze box? Which plaque?

              (Quote)

          • inthechaseto – In reply to your comment:

            Sadly – he is no longer with us. If you only knew him – if he were still here –

            The old guard has changed and in his place –
            a new one.

            Can I just say AGAIN,…how much I miss vgboss?:

            www.ttotc.com/the-poem/stanza-3/#comment-390

            Check out the discussion about “your creek” being on Public Land.

              (Quote)

  27. In this chapter when young Forrest asks his mother about the missing ball of string and she is nodding(looking quickly down) and looking out the window for the postman, she then is the blaze and a trail can be organized from the locations written by the postmarks vertically at the beginning of certain chapters as referenced by the poem. I start in west Yellowstone and end up in my back yard. Lol

      (Quote)

    • So Bob, Wow! You live at the Double L in Freedom Wy. Just 50 miles from Yellowstone then? I do believe the Oxbows owner is named Robert. Hmmm just another confirmation for me, thanks!

        (Quote)

      • Uriel- sorry no I don’t own nor live at oxbow. I live in Florida. My back yard is not my back yard it’s FF back yard not in Temple, in Santa Fe. And like Dorothy, he found happiness there after the whirlwind. And we can too, after a long journey away from home. With friends to help us along the way.

          (Quote)

      • Hi Deb! Yes! Finally Zelda bought both books! I see what you mean now, the book is important. I’m using hers. There is much in the book that nobody talks about. Also Deb did you notice I was able to post a photo with my comment yesterday? I got it to work by holding my finger down longer on the selected photo until it copied. I’m still experimenting with posting links without typing the entire link by hand. Maybe someday I’ll get it.
        Haven’t heard from you in awhile Deb, whenever that happens I worry about Meg, and am afraid to ask. Hoping for good news.
        No, the length of my nose hasn’t changed from what I can tell.

          (Quote)

        • I posted here about her , guess you missed it. The tumor was benign ! It was an extremely rare type of tumor , only 17 cases in medical history. They believe it will regrow and she will need more surgery every 3 or 4 years to remove it. Staying on top of it will hopefully prevent it from becoming cancerous.

          Sorry I haven’t written but its just easier to email you Bob. 🙂 besides then you don’t have to try and make out my chicken scratches. lol

          I am so glad you both finally have decided on looking at the book. I don’t believe it can be found without knowing the stories in the book. Good job Bob ! 🙂

            (Quote)

  28. A friend of mine who is very shy has asked me to share this with everyone here on Mikes blog.
    In the chapter Gold and More, Forrest talks about his ball of string and how he uses square knots to tie each thread together. At the end of each chapter in TTOTC, after the period at the end of the last sentence, there is a little box. These are the square knots that tie each thread (chapter) to the next. The thread ball is multi-colored. As are the chapters in the book. The book is the ball of thread. The book is the rainbow and at its end is the epilogue and the pot of gold.

    How did I do shy one?

      (Quote)

    • Bob – Your “Shy One” came up with an excellent solution for how Forrest’s giant ball of string “ties in” (with square knots) to the chapters in the book. I hope ARGUSS33 notices your post. 🙂

        (Quote)

          • Ok. The Thrill of the chase anagrams to “Thither the Echo Falls”. There is an Echo Falls in Santa Fe National Forest. (in the wood) Ball of string anagrams to “bring to falls”. Unfortunately, I don’t think Echo Falls is within the TFTW mapped out playing theater….There IS a rumored hidden cave very near the falls and the falls above Echo is Box Falls. Soon I will claim what is mine. Save your time, money, and effort people. It will be mine. WAY too many synchronicities and signs being sent to me. So, not to come off as arrogant, but ya’all should really just go ahead and stop looking. 😉

              (Quote)

          • Argus- I have stopped looking. But that doesn’t mean much since I was never a real threat to any other searcher anyway. Keep searching Argus! Go get that treasure!

              (Quote)

          • My rainbow = “Ow my brain!”

            My rainbow = “I, Amy Brown” ( Amy Brown. A Colorado physician)

            I think maybe it’s time for me to start playing some of my discoveries a little closer to the chest…. 😉

              (Quote)

  29. I ran across something interesting on the map on pg.133 just right above the gold nuggets and frog, there is a place called “Puerto De Luna” – door of the moon or moons door. Francisco Coronado name it this in 1541 after camping there and he noticed the rising of the full moon shining through this narrow gap in the mountains like a door opening to light the valley area below. Coronado had stopped in this area on his way to find “Quivira” the seven cities of gold. Plus a few other interesting facts that some of you might see as connections to ff. Coronado found the Teyas Indians in Blanco Canyon just east of what is now “Lubbock Texas”. There is also a painting call Coronado, which shows him and his men, and it’s painted by “Fredric Remington”. It is also believed the “Billy The Kid” ate his last Christmas Eve dinner in Puerto de Luna. See any Fenn in these so called facts? So is the moon playing a role in maybe where the treasure chest is hid? Study the map it tells other secrets. Bur

      (Quote)

  30. I am a native Iowan, and my beautiful wife of 32 years is a native Texan, like Forrest (the Texan part I mean), and Texans do not call it “pop”, they usually call it “coke” (for any carbonated beverage), or soda, or soda water. They never call it “pop”, so why does Forrest call it “pop”? He is trying to trick us, I know it.

      (Quote)

    • Remember when soda was in a bottle and if you went hiking around shaking it up a lot of the time the bottle would pop. ( Maybe) Also Mike can you confirm that FF still believes no one has found the treasure box

        (Quote)

      • His website says it has not been found yet to his knowledge. Personally, I believe he is breathing a sigh of relief that it was not found in September, right before the TFTW book signings, and he is resting secure (perhaps falsely secure) that there is little chance that it will be found until Spring.

          (Quote)

    • Here is why I think it may be important. I have seen nothing in Forrest Fenn’s background that indicates he has had any experience or aptitude for designing a treasure hunt structuring a complex system of clues within a facade of a simple poem and memoir. But since he had a desire to do so, he would research techniques used by others. His first planned treasure hunt was in the 80’s when he was diagnosed with cancer which was the height of the genre ( The Jeweled Rabbit, The Golden Horse, etc.)
      The current one was designed more recently during the popularity of Dan Brown’s novels. So I think he probably studied these in designing TTOTC and we may learn something about solving it by studying those.

        (Quote)

    • Chris I wanted to give you something else to ponder. In my opinion Forrest wrote the book(s)and poem to work together.
      In my way of thinking, we need to acknowledge that. A blaze can also be discovering the way Forrest came up with the hiding spot. Thats why it says if you have been wise and found the blaze, following the trail he blazed.
      So maybe its not just the facts of the poem, but the total of his messages and the poem? Think on it.
      deb

        (Quote)

  31. Bout time someone came out and spoke about the Dan Brown connection. Where it leads, who knows.
    “The path is alive, clues are hidden in plain sight” and “Symbols can be very adept at hiding the truth”. Definately a path that commands attention.

      (Quote)

  32. Well, finally I can stop sitting on part of what I found in the book. This is part of the back story I have been talking about all these months. Now everyone who decided that first chapter on important literature can go back and figure out what else they missed.Its all part of the message, he wanted us all to get.

    I didnt want to talk about it publicly because I wanted everyone to start looking a little deeper. ( But nobody listened to the crazy old lady. lol) The whole book is
    filled with this sort of thing. So now, all those lurkers
    out there can try and figure out which story is the right
    one to help solve this. The message is a little more
    complex than just that one observation, but you did
    really good Jack!
    Now there will be understanding in part of why the book reads the way it does.
    Jack, my home of Brown is different than yours. If you listen well to what Forrest has said, you may come to the same question I did.
    deb

      (Quote)

  33. The first few paragraphs of this chapter have to do with him collecting bottle caps and string. I doubt that he did either, and am trying to figure out what he is up to here. Some observations:

    He collected bottle caps “because they were free”, but then says that he had a rule that he “couldn’t collect the cap unless her first drank the pop”. Which way is it? He admits he had a rule, but that he couldn’t “sustian” the rule. Not much of a rule. What is that all about?

    He says he stayed away from diet drinks because he didn’t want to lose weight. Another good reason to stay away from diet sodas would be becasue they were not invented until 1952. So why is he referencing diet sodas that did not exist?

    Why the specific mention of places where bottle caps were “strewn”: the floor, dresser, radio?

    And the string….. give me a break– it never happened.

      (Quote)

    • He references things he wants us to be looking for in our search areas.There are many instances of this through out the books. Should we start listing them all? lol Maybe not, that might make it too easy!

      Mike the ball of string is part of the back story.Yes there is one and it ties everything together. 🙂

        (Quote)

      • Mike –

        If you research bottle caps – the collecting of – if you know what to look for – there is a clue.

        Bottle cap collecting is said to be the new money – geez.

          (Quote)

      • Hi Mike,

        My take on caps is that it seems to be a theme of the process of “collecting”. My opinion is that to solve poem, the caps represent the system of collecting that may be represented in a solve.
        A List of Names with large and small caps ( IO of Upper ) are 11 in number are “easy 2 find”
        Places are “On” 3 listed, floor, dresser, radio, and other places total 4 plus places.
        Floor can represent bottom or nonsense, just as radio could be to represent ‘air’ or top message.
        Grapette as a favorite could be represented as a keyword.
        Grapette used in a playfair box ( use an Imaginary rectangle to encrypt & decrypt ) would utilized as GRAPET ( Grape T ) populating 5×5 alphabet square as the keyword does not use repeated letters.
        The use of “nickels” may be a way hint at using a 5 x 5 box.
        Page 97 next to last paragraph “game, tapping” might be referring to “TAP CODE” that uses a 5 x 5.

        en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tap_code

        One ( 1 ) rule 1st D rank, rank definition means “row”, prerequisite.
        A simple link to me is that most people drink soda pop “COLD”, as poem line your (FF) effort will (death) be (B) worth the cold.
        The soda cap collecting is an overall example of how to construct puzzle pieces:
        List of related information
        Name of related information
        order of related information
        code system
        use a keyword
        etc…

        Then string relates to choosing something different to collect ( and they will not be listed in 1 sentence )

        In looking at this I find that ff father “adds” caps
        and ff mom “subtracts” string ball ( clew ).

        just some thoughts, as “certainty of location” suggest answer to be decoded.

        TGC & CS

          (Quote)

    • on the large ball of string i see a possible modern pop culture reference

      i dont think F put any pop culture references like that as far as the 9 clues and finding the treasure, but i think it is possible he put in some just for fun and as subtle confirmations if they happened to go along with something with the Chase and he thought it would be cool if someone recognized it

      the first page of flywater appears to me to make multiple subtle references to it, and if f did put it in there, then the story about the large ball of string really slams it home.

      i heard there was a story in the new book about f being sorry he killed a cat. this could also be a subtle clue on the same thing, relating to someone being sorry for killing a dog.

        (Quote)

      • My opinion: The ball of string story contains a possible clue in the square knots and different colors strings. The disappearance of the ball of string was a mystery that was never solved. The knots may be a reference or confirmation to the knots on the rope with the school kids. The different colors of string may be a clue to the colors in Tea With Olga. I think the fact that the ball was tied with “square” knots is definitely significant. As far as the bottle caps, the first one mentioned is Dr. Pepper and that is an important clue. Research the movie roles of Tom Hanks: Forrest Gump, struggled in school, went to Vietnam in 1968, returned as a decorated hero and became very wealthy entering a business he knew nothing about. His favorite drink was Dr. Pepper. Sounds like another southern boy named Forrest that we all know. Hanks played James Lovell in Apollo 13 and covered the moon with his thumb. He played the lead character in “Philadelphia Story” . FF covered Philadelphia with his thumb. Keep following the Tom Hanks connection to Robert Langdon, master clue solver in DaVinci Code and Angels and Demons, written by Dan BROWN who placed clues hidden in art work, anagrams and ciphers.

          (Quote)

        • Jack: “The disappearance of the ball of string was a mystery that was never solved.”

          I believe that Forrest provided enough clues to resolve this mystery. Why do you think his mother kept looking out the window, nodding? Looking for the postman? Nope. Again, a window is in play.

          Jim Lovell was most noted for covering the Earth with his thumb when he was at the Moon. Just a technicality.

          But you are nicely drawing attention to one of the techniques that Forrest uses to interTWINE fiction with non-fiction, despite the notion that there’s nothing worse than facts written wrong. Perhaps in Forrest’s mind his life stories are simply fables agreed upon by himself. He did say that TTOTC was given to him by some unknown hand.

          Hey, what about Cast Away? Or Road to Perdition, or Turner & Hooch?

          SYand42lbsHeavier,
          Halogetter

            (Quote)

          • Halogetter, you are correct. He covered the earth with his thumb.
            In Important Literature he wrote:
            “Besides, some of the things I do pretty good I’m better at than some of those college guys are at what they do pretty good.” That sounds more like Gump would have written it than Fenn. He hints at the Gump connection when he says he and Peggy had to forego things like movies and Dr. Pepper. I think what he is doing is connecting himself to Dan Brown through the roles of Tom Hanks. Treasure hunts, hidden clues, etc. are the “home of Dan Brown”. They were “put in below” (underneath) the literal reading of the book and poem.

              (Quote)

  34. azuredeb:
    For those of you who dont have the book, this is the last 2 sentences in this chapter :
    I dreamed the other night that I had been reincarnated as Captain Kidd and went to Gardiner’s Island looking for the treasure. It scared me so badly I was jarred awake and dont remember whether I found it or not.

    Thoughts?

    one of the things that jumps out at me on this is, he says its a dream, then he says he was JARred awake.

    if you look to the final page of the next chapter, you see again the reference to dreaming, and its on the page where he is talking about burying the JARs.. ive mentioned previously how DREAM is a key word.

    is there a connection? he mentions the frogs and you see them on the lids of the jars, and the frog in the other chapter has an M or W in its eye. the other thing is he may be drawing attention to “Dancing with the stars”, and there are a lot of pictures in the book with stars. can’t say ive found any real substantial clue along these lines, but those have been my thoughts.

    ok, theres one other thing about the mention of Kidd and Gardiners Island, and i would throw in there that i think he brings up the great gatsby book for this reason. the great gatsby is about people who live on Long Island.

    gardiners island is located on the east end of long island. well it just so happens, that the area where i believe the chest is, is called bla bla bla (i can’t say it, sorry ) and the blaze, and where the chest more specifically would be hidden is located on the east end of ba bla bla, and if i could tell you more directly then you would better understand the strong connection between what FF is saying in the book and this place. anyways, for now, i have to keep it a secret.

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  35. For those of you who dont have the book, this is the last 2 sentences in this chapter :
    I dreamed the other night that I had been reincarnated as Captain Kidd and went to Gardiner’s Island looking for the treasure. It scared me so badly I was jarred awake and dont remember whether I found it or not.

    Thoughts?

      (Quote)

  36. Can anyone tell me what the object is on the gold photo that is just above the chest on the table. It looks like a golden rook chess piece that has a slot that a coin is inserted into. The slit is unusual and why is the coin inserted into it?

      (Quote)

  37. It wouldn’t and shouldn’t matter where you or anyone else found it. Keep your lips zipped about the details and no harm done.

      (Quote)

  38. The main problem that I have with people trying to decipher clues from the gold nuggets, frog and other photos in the book of items from the chest is that Forrest hired Addison Doty to photograph them. If he were arranging them in a particular way, adding tiny symbols to them, etc., he would have to be actively involved in ‘composing’ the shot. I’m sure Forrest gave input on how he wanted them to appear, etc. but (just my opinion) I think it would be too obvious to Doty that FF was trying to make sure such very tiny, faint markings, etc. were visible in the pics.

    If you think these things were added later (photoshopped) I don’t think that’s something FF is familiar with (another opinion of mine) so he would have to get someone else to do it, which would also draw attention to these ‘secret markings’.

    I could be completely wrong and maybe I don’t have a vivid enough imagination, but half of the things people have said that they see I honestly don’t see or if I see them, I don’t consider them anything more than random shapes (such as letters in the frog’s eye, etc.)

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    • The frog in the book is a clue my fellow Chasers but that image of that frog is only telling you that there is another frog with a tarry scant and marvel gaze facial expression. Don’t get fooled by the supposed W/M in the eye of the frog…that is only limiting you and locking you in to that frog (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Herring)….look for the other frog that is the real game changer…is this other frog that vgboss speaks of in the book?………NO!

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      • I’ve kissed a lot of frogs in my lifetime… sad thing tho…. none of them turned into a prince! LOL

        And that W/M in that Frog’s eye is just a MM= makers mark

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        • Kym he’s out there you know…your prince…during this search maybe you will find him someplace North of Santa Fe, 5,000ft above sea level, 300 miles W of Toledo, etc…Keep kissing them frogs…he’s out there.

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          • lol I was wondering how long it was gonna take you lol too funny, you know VG, I really am not looking. 🙂 I left that up to God 12 years ago 🙂
            Same with the chest, I have no earthly idea where it is and cannot just go right to it, even thoI would lovw to buy my own horse and cattle ranch and build cabins and a lodge and swimming pool for people wanting more of God, I just don’t know where it is.

            So, I throw my hands up and will take my vaca, look in a few places I’ve guesstimated on and that’s it. 🙂
            I have had fun chatting tho I haven;t done this in years either. Usually I just get treated as if i have a plague or something lol kinda used to it by now 🙂 I know the reasons why, so I won’t complain. and don’t take anything I say wrong it is not my intent to cause depression in people. 🙂 Thanks VG for still talkin to me 🙂

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          • That’s it…I’m all depressed…now you’ve done it Kym. 🙁

            Just kidding…Party time tonight and tomorrow!!! Nephews and Nieces graduated from HS and loads of parties on my schedule! I’ll be depressed later…like when I go donate the Treasure Chest to the Smithsonian and see plus hold it for the last and final time. 🙁

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          • LOL Well say congrats to your nieces and nephews for me and tell them to remember who they are no matter how successful they get, to not forget God and the ones who helped them get there, to be awesomely proud of themselves and all the hard work, and to remember…. that sometimes the question that needs answered the most…. is the one that hasn’t been asked yet. 🙂

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          • you know VG,I just don’t know why FF says that he’d like to see the chest in the Smithsonian!! UGH!
            that is a total contradiction to say that when he doesn’t like the ‘don’t touch’ theme or the ‘we’re just gonna put it on a shelf protected by Plexiglas and LOOK at it!” thing, why would he even say that ? lol

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          • last frog was 12 years ago then my coach turned into a pumpkin and I became kymerella again LOL
            Kymerella,kymerella, night and day it’s kymerella, sweep the dishes, do the floor!
            gotta run ,have a great day 🙂

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      • The thing about a Red Herring is that it’s a false goal, unless you’re a herring fisherman! Some of my newer interpretations use a “near miss” as waypoints. A clue that points at first read to an obvious location, but a little deeper that’s not it. Forrest intendeds for the weak minded and feint of heart to crumple that map up, toss it in the trash, and look somewhere completely different. To throw us off.

        What made me re-examine my old locations was my son. Forrest said a child could find the treasure. My son is not quite a year old, he’s got a thousand dollars worth of toys knee deep all over the house, what’s his favorite toy? An empty water bottle. Loves ’em. Crawls warp speed across the floor if he sees you leave one in his grabable reach. Re-examine your discarded spots, look around, squint sideways. That water bottle is a hammer, a rattle, a teething chew toy, a dad smacker.

        Example; Where Warm Waters Halt has been interpreted as where the Firehole hits the Madison. But that’s not it, too obvious. I’m not starting there, but somewhere not far from there (but too far to walk) that also fits the clues although is a less in-your-face way.

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        • Do you really think he would place it in a National Park? A State Park or any kind of park? NO – the treasure would be in litigation for years. He is very smart. That’s one of the many reasons I’m looking in CO.

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          • Litigation? It’s “Take the chest and go in peace” not “Take the chest and send a press release”. 🙂

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    • Thanks peace,
      I too don’t see stuff in frog’s eye at the moment.
      I originally thought my book had “check” mark between poem lines 8 & 9.
      I do see green arrow in the gold piece above the frog – oblong gold – smaller gold piece ( here about 1/4 inch from the bottom this top gold piece above the oblong piece where they connect ) .
      Now as a validation i don’t know, it may be that it is just my book or just a printing process error, or purposeful ( olive jar contains microprinted memoir)
      As to photo shopping there is a photoshop image on page 131 where the pile of coins is the same pile of coins duplicated one on top of another.

      BTW you have a nice piece on the attorney finder rights.

      I guess it’s just my book?

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    • You may need a magnifying glass to see it in one of the gold pieces.

      I guess everyone has already seen this 4 line arrowhead pointing to the previous page and this is a mute point.

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  39. @Musstag

    I’m assuming you’re directing this at me. I have the book. I’ve read it many times and have referred to it repeatedly looking for bits that might reinforce some of my theories. I’m just not looking for 100’s of clues from every single word in the book. That’s just my approach and my opinion, so YOU are wrong by assuming that I have not read the book.

    Your post comes off as a tad aggressive which I know is pretty easy to do when cowering behind a fake name and a keyboard. Let’s try to keep things civil and think before you speak before making an assumption about someone. OK? I’d appreciate that.

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    • Sorry about that Peacemaker. IT WAS meant for Chris Yates, but not sure where the post landed. But right after I sent oit I see that Yates DOES have the book. Sorry Guys!

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  40. While reading through the book again (Gold and More), I felt the need to google “ball of string”, thinking there may be some hidden meaning there. Here’s what I found: String Meaning and Definition. (n.) A hoax; a trumped-up or “fake” story. What you all think?

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    • It could just mean he is tying the story together for you with his clues….piece by piece. I’m sure the ball of string means something but I don’t know what yet.

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        • No I dont believe he is, he seems concerned in how people think of him.I think the publicity in the artfacts case left Forrest wounded in his heart because he saw himself from other peoples eyes maybe for the first time. He never considered collecting to be hurtful to anyone because that was how he was raised.Now he has reached the end of his lifetime and sees that bad publicity as a stain on his life. That is why I dont believe he would knowingly scam any of us.Thats just my opinion, I am known for giving people the shadow of a doubt.Wouldnt want to live any other way.

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          • I don’t believe he would knowingly scam any of us either.
            I hope the “ball of string” is to imply he has “embellished” his stories bit”, (for the sake of the poem) That’s the secretive, ff totc way, right?

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        • I prefer to link the ball of string to the Gatekeeper of Yellowstone. I would love to go into detail but i’ll refrain from divulging what i read until my search next month. My opinion is that it has something to do with embellishing a bit.

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          • Notsowise, I do believe most of the stories are embelished simply to get his messages across to us.I dont think he deliberately misleads like so many believe. I do believe he crafted it all so that people would think of multiple locations but to fit only one. Very clever!

            JJ, good luck on your trip, stay safe and above all enjoy your chase!

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      • Well after having read way too much about a ball of string subject going to add my own string. What if the ball of string is just figural ? What is the big thing in the middle of the room that no one talks about? Think symbolism, not realism.

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  41. The following is an e-mail exchange that Dal posted on his blog 1/26/12:

    “Dear Mr. Fenn,
    We are a group of avid elderly bridge players in San Diego who after reading your book hope to find your treasure. We are not into poetry as much as the memoir. We realize the clues are in the poem, but were wondering if there isn’t at least one clue in each chapter.
    Thank you for a great book
    Sincerely,
    Emily

    Forrest’s succinct response:
    Emily,
    All of the information you need to find the treasure is in the poem. The chapters in my book have very subtle hints but are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker. Good luck in the search. f”

    If you watch all of the interviews in chronological order, FF didn’t start placing emphasis on the book until they started selling post- Today Show (good marketing move) and the importance has grown from the above statement to “you need to read the book many times” (sic).

    Just some food for thought.

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    • Thanks for posting that. I have never heard the “read the book many times” quote, however. I’ve heard him say, read it once, then read it again, slowly.

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    • And, it goes without saying of course, that this statement “reinforces” my position, to the extent that is even possible, that the poem is all you need, to lead you to the end of the rainbow, where the chest is hidden, though perhaps to not as precise a location as I would like.

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    • i think you got it backwards on the marketing thing

      this is from the jacket of the book

      “Unlock the clues that are scattered among these pages and you can go home with a bronze chest so full of gold and precious jewelry that it’s almost too heavy for one person to carry”

      this is a quote from FF that was a dare issued by him to all searchers out there. notice it says clues scattered across the pages, putting an emphasis on all clues contained in the book, and the poem is a part of that of course, but it is only one page of the book.

      i did a little research on this, and this has been there from since the book was first being printed. it wasn’t until this whole chase really started blowing up that you started to get statements from FF that were putting emphasis on the poem even to the extreme of saying, all you need is the poem, which is really painting a different picture then when this first started.

      there is a reason for this i think, as this thing got big, the number of searchers and people studying the book and poem became exponentially bigger thereby greatly increasing the chances of this puzzle being solved by someone, i think FF decided it was ok at this point to start carefully phrasing things a certain way to employ misdirection. the clues in the book are so critical, that if FF can say things that imply the opposite, without ever actually saying something false, he would do it.

      if i am right about this, and i think i am, he has been very successful in steering people in the wrong direction, believing something that isn’t true, it isn’t what he has actually ever said, and it contradicts other things that have been made so clear when you examine everything he has communicated as a whole. of course he hasnt contradicted himself, but he has gotten people to take a contradictory meaning. i see a lot of people here on this blog who have fallen for this, and it effectively removes you from having a realistic chance of solving this puzzle if you do.

      The email you posted is a good example of this misdirection. First, consider that not only did FF give this reply in an email, but then he decided to provide this email to Dal so he could post it on his blog. That was intentional.

      Now look at what he says.

      “The chapters in my book have very subtle hints but are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker. “

      This is technically true. The clues in the poem are placed deliberately in deliberate locations that when unlocked/solved are very important to finding the treasure. The clues in the poem are also deliberately placed to point you to certain things in the book when you solve them. This is why the clues in the book are not “deliberately placed”, they are scattered among the stories, and they won’t be seen or understood except in the context of what the poem is talking about.

      The clever misdirection here is because FF can say they are NOT deliberately placed to aid the seeker. The meaning could be taken that the clues in the book are not intentionally there to aid the seeker, or simply the clues in the book do not aid the seeker. But that isn’t what he said, yet if the meaning is taken that way, then it steers someone away from an important facet of this puzzle, that the clues in the book are not only important, but critical to the solving of the whole puzzle and finding the precise location of the treasure.

      FF isn’t exactly wanting to help anyone by explaining that this is important facet of the puzzle. That is part of the puzzle itself, is understanding the nature of the puzzle. Funny enough though, FF has actually said a lot that indicates how important the book is, reading it, and thinking about it, and yet people take a contradictory meaning in a few of his other statements, and all these other things he said, they just suddenly throw it away.

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      • It’s certainly a well thought out, well expressed, logical, alternate, theory Chris. It’s also more complex than just taking Mr. Fenn at his word. It pushes the limit of the KISS principle, and stands in conflict with Occam’s Razor. It presumes that Mr. Fenn doesn’t think the solution is difficult enough, and that he must therefore introduce additional difficulty via misdirection.

        In the end, either the bookies or the poemies will prevail!

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  42. Here, Forrest mentions the “subtle clues within the book”. Is anyone making a list of how many clues they’ve discovered? And, if so, are the subtle clues helping to validate your poem clues?
    I’ve found 9, so far… Plus, they all tie in with the poem clues and my blaze I have ‘somewhat’ located.

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        • I know there has to be more than one spot the clues line up with otherwise i’d be leaving right now (lol). A year of this has made me grow very patient. No more hasty decisions that end in disappointment.

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          • Yes, “patience”… I could use a little more of that! It’s difficult for me also to wait to go search. But I don’t want to go alone…so I have to wait until I have someone to go with… I guess I’m not too “brave in the wood.”

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        • NotSoWise If you want someone to go with let me know I’m real comfortable in the woods Spend most of my life in the woods

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          • Thanks Woody, very nice of you to offer, but I have someone lined up to go with… but have to wait until the 4th when they have a few days off. Hopefully weather will be permitting.

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        • only read the book once Didn’t find the need to read it again I grew up on the New Mexico , Colo boarder been all through both states on horseback know them better than anyone alive. and I’M almost 60

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    • 3 words, that validate three separate clues in the poem.
      2 other clues that may help refine the location.

      and perhaps a couple other almost-clues. Things that seem like they might mean something but I’m not sure what. Those are the ones that I have identified. There are also some some other interesting subjects in the book, and likely other clues I haven’t discovered.

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